Jul

8

Advice to Filipino Artists

Filed Under Comics Artists, Filipino Artists, Philippine Comics | 41 Comments

This is purely unsolicited advice, but nevertheless, it’s advice that needs saying. Don’t swipe. Don’t use someone else’s drawing and claim it as yours. Don’t copy a drawing exactly from another artist be it a drawing or a photograph, and then pass it off as yours. I’m not talking about styles here. That argument is long finished. I’m talking about downright plagiarism.

If there’s something that’s disappointed me about Filipino comics creators, from the past to the present, are these cases of plagiarism. I’ve seen it happen. And it’s disappointing every time. Typically, one artist would plagiarize other artists, most commonly foreign artists, and then pass off the work as their own.

Artists from an older generation felt they could probably do it because after all, who would know? These comics won’t be seen again anyway. But then the computer age came, and the Internet, and all of a sudden secrets don’t seem so secret.

There’s a case of another creator from the early 70’s who claimed to have created a certain character and made a whole series about it. In truth, the character was swiped, title and plot, from an obscure Italian movie.

It’s one thing to do it in the 70’s, but today in the age of the Internet, you would think artists would be wiser, but the thing keeps going on.

There’s a case of another artist who copied a popular American comics artist’s work, line for line, color for color, then slapped the name of his character and his own name, right on the drawing. He even put it up for exhibit. Inevitably, photos were taken and then found themselves online.

Now it stirred up quite a debate at the message board a few years ago. I was on the side of taking the images off the board, and deal with the situation directly. Lately, I’m leaning more and more towards disclosure. If someone out there comes out with a local swipe file website, then it’s something I won’t have objections over. I’ll even support it.

The most devastating example of a swipe is this Magneto cover which was swiped from the official photograph of the King of Spain. It’s a non-Filipino artist. But imagine if it was?

There is nothing more embarrassing for any artist to be outed on the swiping that they have done for all the world to see.

Equally, there is nothing more infuriating than your work being stolen and then claimed as the work of another.

There is argument that foreign artists copy from us, like this American artist who copied a Coching pose, like it’s justification of some sort. Everybody’s doing it, why not us? Go ahead and jump off the cliff because all the other lemmings are doing it, why don’t you?

I don’t care about the artistic inadequacies of other artists. I care about OUR artists and what they do. Because what they do reflects upon ME as a Filipino artist.

I’m writing this now because a fellow Filipino wrote to me, angry, because another Filipino artist stole his work and is passing it off as his own as he applies for work. I would be angry too. And I am. Because I know both of these artists. And while I am angry for one, I am deeply disappointed in the other.

A local swipe file website. Name names. I think it’s about time.

Full disclosure. I’ve done it myself for one panel in my entire career. I’m embarrassed to look at it now. When it was published, I swore I’d never do it again.

Feel free to comment. But remember, no anonymous posts, specially for THIS topic. Anonymous comments won’t be posted.

Comments

41 Responses to “Advice to Filipino Artists”

  1. dexterwee on July 8th, 2009 10:14 am

    Strong point there Gerry.
    I hope this will be a lesson learned for everybody.
    We are all born original and unique created in the image of our Creator! And that is a magnificent thing. So therefore let us be true to ourselves and be original in our being. It doesn’t hurt to be original in our work but what does hurt is being a “second rate – trying hard – copy cat”.
    It’s best to be honest and true to ourselves.

  2. plsburydoughboy on July 8th, 2009 10:21 am

    Big fan of the blog, & your twitter Gerry. Please weblink who’s done what to who, I’ll make sure to spread the info myself.

    I feel you need to make distinction between plagiarism & taking inspiration, or copying style. I hate to put you on the spot, pero you opened up the topic kasi e.

    There are clear examples, of course, where creative minds are not properly given credit or attributed to, like the incident that prompted you to write this.

    But creative minds run free, and we simply cannot avoid inspiration from the things around us. For example, Arre’s Andong Agimat freely takes cues from Pinoy action movies & TV shows, as he freely admits.

    More contentious are some of komiks master Ravelo’s creations, Lastikman (Plastic Man, Fantastic Man or Elongated Man?) and Captain Barbell (Captain Marvel/Shazam). Now I’m not saying they’re plagiarized, in fact Ravelo’s done an admirable job of differentiating them from their foreign counterparts with characterization, backstory, etc, but you can see the resemblance & can infer inspiration.

    Instances also happen where ideas may seem to have been copied due to resemblance, but can be proven to be originally imagined separate from each other, and my example here would be Marston’ s Wonder Woman & Ravelo’ s Darna (who predates the Amazon warrior by 30, 50 years? I think).

    So again, I’m afraid I’m bringing this back to you, & hope to be enlightened by your personal experience and openness. For the sake of clarification, where is the line dividing inspiration & plagiarism?

  3. Ed on July 8th, 2009 10:25 am

    This is what I’m talking about to my past “agent”. You get your arse on the drawing table to perfect your anatomy and human faces in realistic style, and you get to see artists who copy exactly what in the picture they used as “reference”. Then the artist denies that he said he never tried tracing or computer manipulate pictures for his drawings. Sure. Whatever.

    Comic book fans said “…and he still have a job!” My goodness.

    I was asked to try “ink” a computer generated 3D images in B&W, in high-contrast, and make it look like it was really drawn by hand. I mean, come on! I can draw, why not just draw it traditionally? I refused not to do it just to earn something.

    I remember there was this animator/director of “Panday” animated, he said he created Space Ghost and Hanna-Barbera stole it from him. Not sure if it was true. I wonder why he didn’t fight for it.

  4. Bong Redila on July 8th, 2009 10:33 am

    Same goes to all the bastards who make tons of money out of somebody else’s art work without permission. Have you heard of what happened to May Ann Licudine’s work?

  5. Gerry Alanguilan on July 8th, 2009 10:48 am

    plsburydoughboy, if you want me to post your comment, please use your real name. I emphasized this at the end of my article.

    But to answer your question, I think the article I linked to above, with the accompanying photo, should give you an idea of exactly what I’m talking about.

    Here are further examples:
    http://bit.ly/CevjH

  6. gilbert monsanto on July 8th, 2009 10:58 am

    I have to say, i was guilty of this at the start of my career, I was young and didn’t know better. In fact during those time, some editors would show us a cover or any image and say, can you do something like this?

    Now, as far as I know, O couldn’t perfectly copy the image and my style would still come out, ugly. It stopped when I was confident enough to do things on my own, it was like a stage of sort. I am out of it after a year or so.

    I have to say, that at the start of learning, it is not forbidden to copy from your idols. But it should be stressed that if you are going to be paid for it, then it becomes a no no. Like I said, I was young and didn’t know about the term swipes.

    How about the AFTER covers? You know, the artist who does a cover from past covers done by another famous artist and signs JIM LEE after KIRBY? I think that is all I did, and should have signed it that way. I usually copied poses and used the local characters, diff. costumes and faces. Is that swipe or is that AFTER?

    I am sorry to have done it in the past. All in the past. I learned from it, but now I guess, we should tell more people about it.

  7. Gerry Alanguilan on July 8th, 2009 11:14 am

    Gilbert, homages are all right when the original artist is acknowledged, like yes, putting “After xxxx” in the signature. A lot of artists do that, and it’s something generally accepted in the comics industry.

  8. adam! on July 8th, 2009 11:23 am

    We are all born original and unique created in the image of our Creator!

    so ibig sabihin nun, swiped rin tayo!

    seriously though, me aesthetic/theoretical justifications naman ang swiping a la yung Magneto example na sa totoo lang ay arguably sound naman in the artistic sense basta himayhimayin natin. asa mundo naman kasi ng art, e, at sa art, di nadedehado yung original kasi siya ang nagtrabaho, siya ang naghirap, siya ang mas mahusay.

    ang problema ay yung blatant stealing, tulad nung nangyari dun sa Filipino artist na nabanggit sa post, kasi apektado na ang livelihood diyan, ang trabaho, ang pera, at sa ganun, well, ewan ko, wala pa akong maisip na paraan para maaddress yan nang maayos outside sa swipe file website na suggestion. at actually, nageenjoy ako tingnan ang mga ganyang bagay!

  9. Gerry Alanguilan on July 8th, 2009 11:33 am

    I find it hard to justify the Magneto cover because the artist used significant elements of the photographer’s image. Remove the head and the images are virtually identical. Someone did an overlay of this and elements matched precisely.

    But you are right. The last example I gave goes beyond mere plagiarism. This artist simply posted, on his portfolio, the work of another artist, and told potential employers that it was his work. There is no debating the aesthetic/artistic issue of that. It’s quite simply thievery.

  10. adam! on July 8th, 2009 11:53 am

    re: Magneto cover

    ‘di ko siya nakikitang naiiba sa isa pang image na todo ang “pagswipe” sa mundo ng comic book covers, yung Pieta, na off the top of my head ay ginamit sa DEATH OF CAPTAIN MARVEL, sa DEATH IN THE FAMILY, at sa isang cover ng HELLBLAZER, at pati na rin sa cover ng isang isyu ng CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS. visual shorthand, e, yung teorya na kasi hardwired na ang ilang imahen sa utak natin, kasama ang ilang emotional recalls ng imahen na yun, na kapag nakikita natin yun sa ibang lugar, however tight or loose ang paggaya, alam natin kaagad ang ibig sabihin.

    yung sa MAGNETO – isang libro na di ko binabasa, kaya ewan ko kung ano ang kuwento – ang impression ay royalty, smuggery, na siya ang hari ng kung ano sa kung saan. at yung info na King of Spain pa pala yung referenced, at ang Spain ay me kasaysayan ng diktatura/pasismo until thirty years ago, well, medyo effective siya na referencing kung ganun.

    ang dating sa’kin nung article na nakalink ay di masaya ang mga español sa referencing na nangyari kasi masamang tao si Magneto, at sa ganung lagay, ewan ko na. ang dating rin kasi ay katulad ng reaksiyon ng mga tao ke Alec Baldwin tungkol sa sinabi niya sa mail order brides dito, o yung hirit sa DESPERATE HOUSEWIVES tungkol sa mga nars natin sa US. ang concern na’to ay nasa realm pa ba ito ng art? pero di naman iyun ang pinaguusapan natin dito, hahaha! ayun.

  11. Gerry Alanguilan on July 8th, 2009 12:32 pm

    Adam, no that’s not what we’re talking about. I’m not talking about Spain or whatever issues anyone has with them. I’m talking about the work of the photographer, and how it was directly appropriated by another artist and claimed as his own. This is different from Pieta, a historical piece of art known the world over. Any artist who uses that pose would know that everyone would see it’s Pieta. The artist doesn’t go, “Oo, I’m gonna copy Pieta. Hopefully, no one would know about it! he.he.” Additionally, Jim Starlin or George Perez didn’t go and take a photo of the sculpture and trace over it.

    I also have doubts if the Crisis cover is taken from Pieta at all. Think about it. How many permutations can an artist have of someone carrying a limp body? An artist who has never seen Pieta and asked to draw a grieving person carrying a limp body, he would produce a piece of art which would make everyone automatically point and say “PIETA!”.

    It’s a huge grey area. But there’s nothing grey about that Magneto cover.

  12. Jose Mari Lee on July 8th, 2009 12:36 pm

    By Golly wow!

    Now I’m swiping Little Richard’s expression. He-he.

    In the old komiks industry, a lot of younger artists copied Redondo, Alcala and Coching as if there was no tomorrow. I don’t mean one pose or one expression. Most of the time – THE WHOLE PANEL, including dots and dashes in the background. He-he.

    But did someone care? Hell, no. In fact, they want everybody to draw like Redondo, Alcala and Coching. And why not? They’d be paying PEANUTS to the young artists with Coching images? How can the publishers go wrong?

    Yet, NOT ONE artist complained. Never. As if everybody was ordered to: ABOUT FACE! Then: FORWARD, MARCH!

    One… Two… one… two…

    And the industry thrived and everybody happy, including the unsophisticated readers, and the publishers huff and puff their way into the bank. He-he.

    There was even an artist who would use a PANTOGRAPH and copy line-per-line Redondo’s art.
    Heck, that was one for the Guiness Book of World Records!

    It was rampant in the late 60’s and most of the 70s. Funny how even some of these Pinoy artists drew for DC and the same old “VICE” of copying another artist’s art were still utilized. I’ve collected some of these “pinoy workmanship” but they’d remain hidden in boxes. Let’s just let sleeping dogs lie. He-he.

    There were artists in the same decade who did their own style, and some of them were unquestionably good and original, like Alex Niño. Though even amongst writers, I could mention names who were NOTORIOUS in copying other materials, especially from North American novels, but let me just keep my mouth shut. He-he. I know who they are and I can pinpoint exactly where they copied their materials from. Believe it or not, there was one guy who copied per se:
    THE CHARIOTS OF THE GODS?

    Can you imagine? A very popular work of fiction being plagiarized and a lot of gullible readers ADORED the series, not realizing that they would enjoy the original better than the copycat, only if they’d known that an original work actually existed.

    Well, “those were the days, my friend, we thought would never end” as Mary Hopkins used to sing. But, that was then, this is now.

    One copycat from the 1970’s unabashedly posted a copied drawing of a popular character from an American comics… and of all places… THE PKMB! The guy’s an out-and-out nuts! The PKMB site was jolted by a whopping record-breaking INTENSITY 10 on the Richter Scale reactions! Jeepers, the seismograph oscillations would just not stop until the art is taken down. He-he.

    What was so funny was that some of the artists in the site were demanding to PUNISH the guy!
    Huh? Say, what? Let the original artist take care of that. We could turn black and blue from swearing, but that’s all we can do. The original creator should do whatever he thinks is proper, and not anyone else.

    The copycat had presented us with (something we call in French) “embarras de richesses” of art and culture.

    And the embarrassment was more than enough punishment. But, did he apologize for it?
    No fat chance in hell that he did. I’d say he’s too callous to feel guilty about it. For him, perhaps, it is already a way of life.

    This reminds me of an old Spanish saying I’ve always heard my relatives would mention since my childhood: “Genio y figura, hasta la sepultura”
    At a glance, it may look literally deceptive as: “Genius and faces till death”.

    In essence, this saying simply means: “A leopard cannot change its spots.”

    Indeed, some komiks vets are simply that: SPOTTY leopards.

    :(

  13. adam! on July 8th, 2009 1:26 pm

    “Oo, I’m gonna copy Pieta. Hopefully, no one would know about it! he.he.”

    pero assumption pa lang natin dito na me pilyong dahilan sa likod ng pagswipe na ginawa. paano kunwari kung pulitikal palang desisyun ito para sa artist? na isa na namang assumption, oo, pero kung ikokonsidera nating valid na option yung malisya, dapat ikonsidera rin nating valid na option ang political statement, up until malaman natin na talaga kung ano man ang rason niya sa pagswipe na yan. kadalasan kasi (sa kaso nina Roger Cruz, o ni Rob Liefeld), ang rason ay katamaran, o kasi minamadali ang paggawa, kaya ganun, pero kasi me artistic validity naman ang swiping, tulad ng sa mga kanta ng Beastie Boys, o sa mga collage art ni Ernst, o sa mga cutup novels ni Burroughs.

    mukhang ang magiging hatol natin sa mga ganito bilang viewer ay mananatili sa lebel ng taste, na mananatiling case-by-case basis. pero bilang mga artistahing tao, tama naman ang puntong mas maganda kung di gagaya! at kung gagaya man, dapat me magandang rason!

    naaalala ko dito ang quote mula ke Wally Wood: “Never draw anything you can copy, never copy anything you can trace, never trace anything you can cut out and paste up.”

  14. kathleen on July 8th, 2009 2:28 pm

    Baygali! For all the people na gagayahin, Hari pa ng Espanya! geez…I thought stuffs like usually happen in the writing industry, but comics? Am I not surprised? tsk.tsk.Copy artist ako non, para matuto kung paano matuto ng tamang pagdo-drawing, pero di pa ako aware non sa mga copyright thingies, pero so far sa 10 taon kong pagdo-drawing wala pang nag-aakusa sa akin na ninakaw kong style nila ng pagdo-drawing, sa awa ng Diyos. ^^;

  15. Kapre on July 8th, 2009 2:37 pm

    OK lang mangupya kung bagito pa, ang masama kung magaling na ay nangupya pa, at lalong masama kung baliktarin at sabihin na iyong orihinal na artist ang siyang nangupya sa nangungupya, HHHHHHH.

    Ang tanong ay ito, nuon at hanggan ngayon, sino ba talaga sa inyo o sinumang artist ang nakagawa ng tunay na orihinal na gawa na walang katingting na batayan na galing sa iba? Hindi ba si Z ay nangupya lang kay Y, si Y ay nangupya kay X, si X ay nangupya kay W, ……., si C ay nangupya kay B, at si B naman ay nangupya lang kay A. Sino si A at sino ang kinopyahan niya?

    Kung ang Diyos mismo ay nangupya, bakit ang sinumang artist ay hindi puwede? Ehemplo, si Adan ay kinupya lang ng Diyos sa kanyang imahen. Dapat siguro ay paghahambalosin kayo ng DOS-POR-DOS para matauhan kayo, HHHHHHH. Sabi nga ni JM ay huwag ninyong gisingin ang natutulog na aso baka makagat kayo.

    Para hindi mahalata kung nangupya kayo ay kupyahin at paghalu-haluin ang lahat ng mga stelo sa buong mundo, maging mga PINAKBET artists kayo. Punta kayo sa blog ko at marami kayong mga basurang mapupulot duon, mga basurang pantakip para hindi mahalata na nangungupya tayong lahat, HHHHHHH.

  16. Rod Samonte on July 8th, 2009 2:47 pm

    Hmmmm, now let’s see, Roy Lichtenstein makes a copy of some poor comics illustrator’s published work, enlarges it on canvas; Warhol, likewise makes copies of a Mao Tse Tong, a Marilyn Monroe, a Jacquelyn Kennedy, an Elvis Presley photos, enlarges them on canvas, never acknowldging who the original photographers were, and a new art form, POP ART, was born. Both have made million and millions of dollars on what is called Fair Use of another artist’s work. More recently, graphic designer Shepard Fairey, uses a photo by AP photographer Mannie Garcia to design his now famous Obama Hope Poster. His original art for Obama poster is now in a museum, and heaven knows how much he was paid or how much he’s made since his ascension from obscurity. The AP and Mannie Garcia have sued him, but again his defense is Fair Use. I wonder what it feels if one were on the unfair side of a Fair Use battle?
    JM,
    I have no knowledge nor have I seen of anybody who copied Alfredo Alcala. He’s style is uncopyable (if there’s such a word). Coching also was hard to copy. Redondo was the easiest. That’s why everybody was copying him. Why didn’t those artist complain? Well, rather than being mad, I suspect, they were actually flattered they were being copied. And I hope I don’t create an Intensity 10 reaction here when I say that the great Coching himself copied from Alex Raymond.
    Rod

  17. Gerry Alanguilan on July 8th, 2009 3:33 pm

    Rod….Yep, too many people are getting away with stealing other people’s work. That’s the way the world works, I guess. The question is, does it become right just because a lot of people are doing it, and becoming successful at it?

    But I think there’s a world of difference between the work of Alex Raymond and Coching. Now see, this is where the subject starts to veer off from the original. We’re going into the realm of “style”, “influences” and “inspiration”, when all I was talking about was plagiarism. I’ve had it up to my gills talking about styles because it’s a discussion that never ends.

  18. Philip Tan on July 8th, 2009 5:16 pm

    Wow…. hmm Gerry, any chance you can send me links on email to where this is?…. very curious how it looks like….

    I have always been open about this, totally encourage swiping ONLY when it is for practice.. I am a believer that that’s where you start to study a particular way of drawing/rendering best… but to use for work… sigh…. a shame….

    Hope this stops…

  19. knovs on July 8th, 2009 5:47 pm

    Para sa akin, depende na lang sa intention nung gumawa kung masama ba (swipe) o mabuti (inspiration) yung ginawa niyang pangagaya.

    Dun sa kaso nung Roger Cruz (buti na lang hindi pinoy), kitang-kita na halos kinopya na niya lahat ng gawa ni Madureira, nahalata tuloy. Katamaran na ito or pinasok niya ang komiks na wala siyang alam kaya napilitan siyang mandaya.

    Kung sa akin ito gawin, matutuwa pa ako. compliment yon sa akin kasi BILIB siya sa gawa ko. Unless… palabasin nung gumagaya na ako pa ang manggagaya… away yon.

  20. Robby Villabona on July 8th, 2009 11:04 pm

    JM,

    If I recall correctly, people (I among them) were not out asking to punish the artist whose plagiarized art was shown on PKMB. We just wanted people to walk their corresponding talks. You can’t be against plagiarism and be for protecting the reputation of the plagiarist by removing his stolen art from the board. That’s oil and water.

    We only complained that people (including the board admin) took down the picture either to cover up what the guy did or spare him embarassment. It would have been better to leave the picture there for people to see and judge themselves. Whether leaving the picture there for people to see was a form of punishment for the offending artist, then that’s really just a matter of personal opinion.

    Sa experience ko, being lenient on cheats only encourage them to be bolder.

  21. Jose Mari Lee on July 9th, 2009 2:47 am

    “Sa experience ko, being lenient on cheats only encourage them to be bolder.”

    Robby:

    I know you were one of the very vocal ones about this aforementioned incident but you did not demand any punishment like the others who vehemently did. But it was a case of getting caught in the middle of two undesirable alternative choices: one group demanding to remove the art; the other asking to retain it and humiliate the artist.

    I agree about what you said that not giving him some tongue-lashing and/or keeping his plagiarized work for everybody to see – is akin to condoning his nasty practice. But, keeping the art there will only annoy so many people that Marboy boldly talked to the person involved and told him pointblank that what he did was foul and therefore, the art will be removed. If I were there in RP, I would have gone with Marboy and gave the plagiarist a piece of my mind as well. He was one of the notorious persons in the old komiks industry, whose drawings and writings were not really worth reading. The removal of his copied art was not really condoning his act, it was just to put an end to the vexation of many PKMB people.

    The guy must have learned his lesson after all. He had abandoned PKMB since then and we’ll probably not see him here again. Maybe it was his way of saying: “times have changed and gotta clean up my act.” Who knows?

    Rod Samonte:

    May mga nangopya kay Alfredo Alcala. Kung natatandaan mo yung drawing ni ROD SANTIAGO, siya ang matagal na kumopya sa drawing nito, but let’s face it, wala ni sa kalingkingan ang naging result. Later, kinopya naman niya si Vir Aguirre, pero very poor cloning ang nangyari. Ang anatomy kasi ng drawing niya ay atrocious, kinopya niya ang style ng mga magagaling, pero pinabayaan niya ang tunay na crux of the matter – ang tamang anatomy. Ito ang ini-emphasize noon nina Redondo, kaya nga ang mga nag-aral kay Redondo ay tunay na nakaiintindi sa tamang anatomy. Isa sa mga naging solid ang knowledge sa anatomy ay si Dell Barras. Nag-umpisa siya sa style ni Redondo, pero hindi nagtagal ay nagkaroon ng sariling identity ang kanyang obra. Kung sa tiyaga at hard work, champion itong si Dell, at hindi nagpabaya sa constant evolution ng kanyang art.

    Supremong Kapre:

    Kung minsan, okay lang na gisingin ang asong natutulog, basta’t humanda tayo kung mangagat ito. Hindi bale na lang kung walang rabies ang asong nabanggit. Kaya ihanda ang dos por dos dahil kung asong ulol pala ang kaharap mo’y may depensa ka kahi’t paano.

    :)

  22. adam! on July 9th, 2009 6:59 am

    Believe it or not, there was one guy who copied per se: THE CHARIOTS OF THE GODS? Can you imagine? A very popular work of fiction…

    HINDI FICTIONIST SI VON DANIKEN, HA!!!!!!!

  23. jim on July 9th, 2009 7:51 am

    There’s something unclear to me about the Magneto/king of Spain issue. If I was asked to draw The Statue of Liberty, and since i haven’t seen it in person and so i have to google it up and say, found a wonderful full shot taken by a Juan de la Cruz. and i copied it because it fits my specs. that would be unfair for Juan de la Cruz? so my next question would be, how do i get around it, to be fair? its the exact same pose and detail/ specs i needed.

  24. Jose Mari Lee on July 9th, 2009 8:34 am

    “HINDI FICTIONIST SI VON DANIKEN, HA!!!!!!!”

    Huh? Say what? At sino ang may sabing FICTIONIST ito? I didn’t, for sure. Go back and find where I mentioned anything like that.

    Ang sabi ko, it was a well-known work of fiction.
    This is how I personally categorized this work: FICTION. But I didn’t say Daniken is a FICTIONIST.

    Just because allover the world there are ruins and improbable objects which cannot be explained by conventional theories of archeology or religion, doesn’t mean the material cannot be considered fiction.

    I certainly would not categorized CHARIOTS OF THE GODS? a factual work. The existing matter in question is factual, but his idea that most of these things were done by ALIENS is quite controversial. There is no Archimedan Point (a clear-cut qualification) here on earth on what is contradictory, especially when a mysterious event takes place that science cannot explain.

    Therefore, if it is not proven 100%, I will categorize it as a fictionalized view, same thing as Dan Brown’s very boring best seller that hoodwinked a lot of people: THE DA VINCI CODE.

    Now, if you tell me that PORTNOY’S COMPLAINT has a possibility of happening in real life, I’d say yes without batting an eyelid. If you’re compulsive-obsessive, you are capable of doing what he did, and that is: MASTURBATE 100 TIMES A DAY!

    So, Adam, you’re right. DANIKEN IS NOT A FICTIONIST. But I don’t know why you said that, since NO ONE SAID that in the first place.

    I hope I have clarified what I’ve said.

  25. Eusebio Yu on July 9th, 2009 9:02 am

    One person’s swipe is another person’s homage. A fine line. Speaking of Pieta, check out the very last page of the last issue of 100 Bullets. More of symbolism than anything else.

  26. adam! on July 9th, 2009 10:04 am

    Mr Lee, that was a joke thrown a la Von Daniken fan trolling the interweb to shout at people who say Von Daniken’s a loon.

  27. Gerry Alanguilan on July 9th, 2009 10:04 am

    Jim, the issue with the Magneto cover is the appropriation of the work of the photographer who took the picture. If you remember, a similar issue arose with our central bank when it made unauthorized use of a photograph from an Asian magazine as basis for Ninoy’s portrait on our 500 peso bill.

    If you make use of any statue of liberty images you find on google as a reference to draw your own statue of liberty, that would be all right. But if you trace over a photograph directly, or use the photo itself, then that is making unauthorized use of that photographer’s work, unless the image is already in the public domain.

    When using a photograph that you did not take for reference (that is not in the public domain), I suggest you make sure that your drawing is slightly different. Change the angle slightly, change the shading slightly, change the background. Make your drawing look like it wasn’t copied from that photograph. Just use it as a guide.

    More and more artists are being outed for using Google images directly, and it can get embarrassing. Check out this outing of Kyle Baker:
    http://www.bleedingcool.com/2009/06/18/swipe-kyle-deadpool-900/
    Even if Kyle used public domain images, it can certainly affect the artist in many ways. If you can take the heat, then by all means.

  28. Gerry Alanguilan on July 9th, 2009 10:15 am

    This post was meant to advice caution to Filipino artists (and not just in comics), to take great care with the work that they do. I’m not here to debate about the validity or not of a swipe, if it’s homage, or a tribute or whatnot. The perception of the work that you do IS the issue. If you copied from another artist, specially if you are an artist with a high profile comic book locally or abroad, chances are you will be outed. Artists are being outed on a regular basis. It won’t be a picnic for you, and by extension, your fellow Filipino comics artists, if one day your work be posted publicly at some site exposing similarities of your work with the work of another.

    This is just a word of caution. Use your reference material wisely. They’re there to guide you, not to be copied.

  29. Jose Mari Lee on July 9th, 2009 10:26 am

    “Mr Lee, that was a joke thrown a la Von Daniken fan trolling the interweb to shout at people who say Von Daniken’s a loon.”

    Hi Adam:

    Indeed, he may look like a loon to some people, especially his critics, but let’s face it: the guy’s work is INTRIGUING. He surely observes his surroundings while many don’t. I think it’s his brief “grand vacation” in the slammer that makes a lot of people look down on him. You know how people can be so judgmental in many ways.

    Re: copying

    I think, the solution to the problem of being accused of copying photos, the artist himself should take his own photos and draw them. Sometimes taking a series of photographs can really enhance the realism of the work once it becomes an illustration. It only becomes shaky if you copy someone else’s photo and claim it as your own illustration. Nowadays with sites like FOTOLIA, GETTY, et al, it’s very tempting for artists to just take a look at them and draw them with little change and hope that nobody catches them.

    Doing your own photo and using your own models will surely set the artist free. I mean nowadays with digital cameras with point and shoot convenience, that’s not too hard to do. You can be in a fast food, a park, beach, etc., and you can even take pictures of people in different poses without them knowing you were taking their images.

  30. Kristel on July 9th, 2009 12:19 pm

    The local clothings store Bayo once plagiarized art from a Japanese graphic artist. References here:

    http://blog.kapenilattex.com/2005/05/24/bayo-young-talented-plaigarizer/

    http://delcj.livejournal.com/229345.html

  31. Reno on July 9th, 2009 2:48 pm

    Just to chime in a bit… How about photo collages? I remember P. Craig Russell made a photo collage in the Killraven Graphic Novel, would that count as plagiarism, since he appropriated photos that were clearly not his own?

    I think it would be akin to what Warhol and Lichtenstein did. Would that be a correct assumption?

  32. auggie on July 9th, 2009 3:16 pm

    JM,

    How about that world famous foto of CHE Guevarra, transformed into a line shot, silk-screened, and became a staple best seller T-Shirt globally. Nag complain ba yung photographer ?

    Yung swipe ni Roy Lichenstein sa drawing ni Russ Heath, na OKAY, HOT-SHOT, galing sa isang DC Comics, noong 1962, eh palagay ko OK lang ko Russ Heath. Kasi ang feeling ni Russ eh mas na edify pa yung gawa niya at naging high brow at nadi-display sa mga prestigious art galleries around the world. In a sense, Roy has done him a favor. Sa tingin ko, it was a win-win situation.

  33. Gerry Alanguilan on July 9th, 2009 3:28 pm

    Reno, if the photos are in the public domain, I think that’s all right. But if they aren’t, and the original photographer sees it and decides to take legal action, the artist would have to deal with that. Waving “Fair Use”, a fairly nebulous legal thing to begin with, won’t spare you the hassle of someone getting pissed at you for using their work.

    That’s what I’m really just saying. An artist can do what he wants. But using other people’s work, and/or copying other people’s work may have consequences. Some more serious than most. Some people get away with it, and even profit from it. What if you become one of those artists who don’t get away with it? What if, just this once, someone decides to take legal action? What is some blogger decides to put your work along with the original in a swipe website? Once your work is out there, there’s nothing you can do about it anymore.

    Isn’t it better to just avoid the hassle all together?

  34. mico suayan on July 9th, 2009 8:18 pm

    I’ll be swiping some Oliver Coipel panel for my new work sa THOR. But for continuity sake lang hehehe!

  35. Pinoy Comics USA on July 10th, 2009 1:30 am

    Artists from an older generation felt they could probably do it because after all, who would know?

    Gerry,
    I don’t know if this statement is correct. In fact, everybody knew, because unlike today the komiks world was much, much smaller. References were not as easy to access unlike now with the internet, what easier way than to just copy someone’s else work.
    Interesting link on Madureira and Cruz. I like Madureira’s work. Don’t know if I’ve seen Cruz.

    Mico,
    Wow, astig itong susundan mong si Oliver Coipel, really like his Thor. I can’t wait to see your version.
    Rod

  36. Gerry Alanguilan on July 10th, 2009 11:07 am

    Tama ka Rod. Hanggang ngayon may gumagawa pa rin e. Mga bata pa.

  37. mico suayan on July 10th, 2009 1:29 pm

    Thanks pinoy USA! Pero few pages lang naman gagawin ko sa Thor Annual heheh:D

  38. The Blurb » Swiped! on July 10th, 2009 2:32 pm

    [...] Check out Gerry’s article and the very interesting discussion that followed it. Click here. [...]

  39. Mel Enriquez on July 11th, 2009 8:06 am

    Can’t help but comment on “the blurb’s” post… (i think Advertisement is the more appropriate word. LOL!)

    C’mon man, you could have chosen another blog entry to do this. But on an article about “swiping”? Hahaha! It’s just ridiculous. Can’t you write your own article?

    Anyway… since I’m already here. Photo-referencing -even tracing -is okay in my opinion, as long as the photographer gets properly credited.

    It takes an immense amount of talent to make good drawings, regardless whether it is copied or traced. Just try to pick a random guy on the streets and have him trace over Obama’s photograph!

    It’ll probably take you hundreds of strangers (on a lucky day) before you can draw out someone who can produce a high-grade quality of a drawing.

    Besides, photography and illustration, although both art forms are very different from each other. No camera can produce a photo that is pencil-rendered, oil-painted, etc. (at least for now! :D)

    I wouldn’t elaborate any further. The 2 mediums are different and cannot really “plagiarize” each other. One simply has to credit the creator of the other to replicate the artwork in his other medium.

    Thanks.

  40. Gerry Alanguilan on July 11th, 2009 8:51 am

    Mel, that’s why not everyone can be an artist. Yes, it does take an immense amount of talent. The lack of which is no excuse to copy/trace/plagiarize. If one can’t draw, then it’s probably best to find another job. Crediting the photographer is a good thing… but it’s better if you get his permission too. And I assure you, having had experience asking permission, not all of them say yes.

  41. Azrael on July 11th, 2009 10:15 am

    seryoso issue nga ito at kahit ako pag may na encounter na swiping artwork na gawa ng local artist natin e..sympre nakakahiya din..lalo na pag may nagsumbong haahah.. eh di lalo dyahe.

    mabuti na ito at nailabas na,.at sana wag na gayahin at matuto gumawa ng orig